Minutes of Premier Leagues Development Meetings, 26.11.12 and 05.02.13



Tyldesley RUFC    26th Nov 2012 7.00pm


Nowirul Committee – John Powell, Greg King

Preston Grasshoppers – John Young

Sedgley Park – Chris Leader, Steve Hazzelby

Burnage – Stewart Wilson, Tony Fox

Chester – Bob White

Fylde – George Brocklebank

Lymm – Peter Millichip

Vale of Lune – Tony Gilmour

Birkenhead Park – Neil Shaw

Liverpool St Helens – Ron Hall, Martin Jones

Altrincham Kersal – Trevor Laga

Rochdale – Aarran Howorth


Caldy – Peter Wallace, Wilmslow – Simon Muckle, Stockport – Roger Hooley

Non Attendees

Macclesfield, Wirral, Waterloo, Sandbach

Introduction by John Powell

Information about the agenda for the meeting and some statistics were distributed

League started 03/04 as 1st Division. Renamed Bateman Premier Division 04/05. Mid season Conference started 10/11. May 2012 AGM rejected motion to change the structure of the Premier League.

JP felt that a Premier League needed to be of benefit to all teams involved and that any restructuring should be followed for the next three seasons.

Open Discussion

MJ – LSH   MJ was asked to outline his Motion to split Premier Division into 2 leagues was tabled by LSH at the last AGM &   rejected by 22 votes to 8

RH – LSH  Several Clubs who did not attend AGM, were in favour of the motion

JY – PG   Did not want as many as 5 fixtures in 1 season against the same opposition

MJ – LSH  Did not see that as a problem. Could be 4 times under present system. Gave status on heavy defeats this season compared with last, showing a slight reduction. Also said LSH 2nds had used 51 players this season

BW – Ch  Chester 2nds used 86 players last season

SH - SP  Would prefer status quo. Clubs like the chance to play the top sides

AH - Roch   Echo that comment. Our club aspires to play at that level

JY – PG Would prefer status quo

TF – Burn  Would prefer stastus quo. Their 2nds found it very hard last season, but relished the challenge

MJ – LSH  Some of the mismatches were down to availability of substitutes. Some teams used more than 3, some teams had none or were short of a full team 

A discussion took place about substitutes but no changes were proposed. JP suggested that teams stick to the rules to avoid complaints.

CL –SP  Made the point that lower teams in Conference A have nothing to play for. Similarly, higher teams in Conference B 

JY –PG  The situation varies for each club from season to season. Examples of West Park & Manchester

MJ – LSH  Stated player recruitment was an issue. Players being enticed to stronger clubs for betterment but ending up playing 2nd team rugby.

PM – Lymm  Difficult drafting 3rd team players into 2nd team when playing the top sides. Would prefer no Conference, revert to 1 league

At this point the meeting was asked if they wished to make any proposals for a vote. This was declined.

TG – VoL  Would prefer to leave the structure as it is, but was concerned about the difference in playing levels

It was agreed that no decisions would be made today, but a Premier Division Forum on the website could be set up to discuss opinions prior to a 2nd meeting in late Jan 2013

JP – NOWIRUL  Of the teams that sent apologies, Caldy & Stockport wanted no change, Wilmslow wanted change.

Possible Options

1)       Leave Premier Division as now with Conference split mid season

2)      Divide Division into 2 Divisions of 7 or 8 clubs, clubs playing each other 4 times

3)      Return division to a normal league structure, no Conference split

4)      As 3, but reduce the no of teams to 10, teams playing each other 3 times






Preston Grasshoppers RUFC  –  5th Feb 2013 7.30pm


Nowirul Committee – John Powell, Greg King

Altrincham Kersal – Trevor Laga, Ben Harris

Caldy – Alex Frankis

Chester – James Lutton

Fylde – George Brockbank

Liverpool  StH – Martin Jones, Ron Hall

Lymm – Peter Millachip

Preston GH – A Jebb, G Dyer

Sedgley Park – Steve Hazzelby

Vale of Lune – Tony Gilmour

Waterloo – David Coyne, Cecil van Ousean


Birkenhead Park – Neil Shaw, Burnage – Martin Vernon, Wilmslow – Simon Muckle, Stockport – Roger Hooley

Non Attendees

Macclesfield, Sale FC, Sandbach, Rochdale

INTRODUCTION   by John Powell

After recapping the previous meeting, it was made clear that any decisions made today would need to be ratified at the AGM. We would proceed immediately to a vote on 3 proposals for the structure of the Premier league, in brief:-

1)      Revert to a 14 team league (no Conference)

2)      Stay as now, 14 team league until 1st fixtures completed, then 2 Conferences

3)      Split into 2 leagues from start of season







1st Vote

Proposal 1  -  2 votes, Proposal 2  -  5 votes, Proposal 3  -  2 votes


2nd Vote

After considering the views of 2 non attendees, Proposal 1 was rejected by JP/GK

Proposal 2  -  7 votes,  Proposal 3  -  2 votes

Proposal 2 was adopted by the meeting, the Premier league structure to continue as existing.

Open Discussion on possible Rule changes etc.

1)      Number of teams in league – Stay as now, 14 teams

2)      Carrying points forward from 1st half of season – Rejected

3)      Trophy for leaders at Conference split – Proposed

4)      Trophy for winner of Conference B – Proposed

5)      Alter number of concedes before expulsion – Rejected

6)      Minimum number of players to travel/play – Proposed change to 12 players

7)      Action re heavy defeats – Proposed that winning margins should be capped at 60 points

8)      Champions/Relegation – If possible, in the event of a tie on points, could head to head results be used as the arbiter, not points difference?

9)      Obligatory front row replacement on bench – Rejected

10)   Change number of teams relegated – Rejected

11)   Adopt bonus point system as RFU leagues – Rejected


Meeting closed at 9pm